LOGIN
User Name
Password
Remember me


Register...Forgot password?
Main menu
Leagues
Gonzaga
Blue Max
Cartagena
Wooden Ships...
King Me!
VampiRing
Forum Message
Previous messagePost on the new forumNext message

City:North of San Fransisco US
Personal Data:Male, born: January 19 1962
HomePage or other cool site:http://www.kongregate.com
Membership23years 121days ago.
Last Login2years 323days ago.
Last Move11years 161days ago.
DBurkeG is currently Offline!Send a mail to DBurkeG


Message header
Area/Game:Blue Max
Topic:Rules
Subject:Re: Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
Posted by: DBurkeG - 18years 299days ago.
Message text
HeadMMoid wrote:
TXWard wrote:

Unless you know what the pilot instructions were for the Fokker D.VII, shouldn't apples be compared to apples? The "effective flying time" for the S.E.5a was 1-1/2 hrs., that of the Fokker D.VII was 1 hr. This gives the S.E.5a a 150% advantage over the D.VII, which is even better than the 140% in the game.

I originally came here to learn how to play because I was getting into Canvas Eagles - a game based on Blue Max using miniatures and altitude rules. In CE, ammunition is tracked like fuel, but the fuel boxes are the same as in BM. I disagree that the fuel boxes as shown are a problem, but that's just me.

My wording was inconsistent in the use of "effective flying time". I should have been more clear in indicating that both aircraft (and most similar aircraft) were expected to spend about one hour in the combat zone, regardless of their total endurance. That, however, is no longer what is important.

The problem that is emerging more clearly to me now is that I have been trying to work within and suggest modifications to a fundamentally flawed system. The fuel rules are an arbitrary and historically inaccurate method for controlling game length. I was seeking a way, within the existing rules, to produce more historically consistent games; games without the inaccurate restrictions on many (typically German) aircraft due to their fuel values being based on their maximum flight endurance rather than the way actual combats occurred. Attempting to justify changes based on historical data rather than historical events was a mistake, and I should thank Calsir for putting his finger on the heart of the problem - "Effective flight time is not effective combat time. They have nothing to do with each other."

Unfortunately, without a major rewrite of the rules (which I would neither advocate nor expect), there is still only one way to bring the game somewhat more into line with its historical background, and that is to increase the amount of fuel on the low-fuel aircraft.

While you, and obviously others may enjoy the tactical problems presented by the fuel rules (and that is just fine), those rules simply do not begin to reflect the reality of the combat which the game is supposed to represent. Although Blue Max is only a very, very rough "simulation" (to use that word very loosely) of World War I aerial combat, I personally would prefer that it be no more inaccurate than necessary.


Sorry if I missed your comment on it.... Did you ever check out Phil Halls posts about Blue Max? I did bring the topic forward, and it should be within the first few pages of the forum.

You seem to have noticed what I was thinking of when I first read your post days ago, and that is that changing the fuel rules, or using ammo rules as others have suggested, or similar modifications, would change the game quite a bit. Full re-write or not, it would become something of a different game. Personnally, I have hoped for altitude, or campaigns that included increased pilot stats.


Back to the messages list
Messages thread
Posting elapsed timePosted bySubject

18years 303days Killer1 [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days Capt-Tuttle Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 302days FENRIS Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days ksnake Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days SteveMartin Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days Ray_Collishaw Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
 18years 303days ksnake Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
  18years 303days redwom Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
  18years 302days SteveMartin Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 302days FENRIS Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days Ray_Collishaw Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days warrax Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days DBurkeG Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 302days gugliandalf Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
 18years 301days DBurkeG Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days Zif Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days imdog Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 295days Killer1 Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 295days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days Wishgamer Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days warrax Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
 18years 303days Regis Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
  18years 297days tyree Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days Swartz Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days Capt-Tuttle Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days TnT Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 303days ksnake Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 302days FENRIS Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
 18years 302days docmortand Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 302days rainbow Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 302days BlackSheep Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 302days tyree Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
 18years 302days Calsir Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
 18years 302days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
  18years 301days tyree Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
   18years 301days Zif Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
   18years 301days ksnake Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
   18years 301days ksnake Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
   18years 300days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
    18years 300days TXWard Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
     18years 300days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
      18years 300days TXWard Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
       18years 300days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
        18years 300days TXWard Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
         18years 300days Calsir Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
         18years 299days TXWard Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
         18years 299days teramaze Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
         18years 299days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
          18years 299days Calsir Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
           18years 299days teramaze Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
           18years 298days TXWard Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
            18years 298days Calsir Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
           18years 298days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
            18years 297days Calsir Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
             18years 297days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
         18years 299days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
         18years 299days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
         18years 299days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
          18years 299days DBurkeG Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
           18years 299days TXWard Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
           18years 299days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
            18years 299days DBurkeG Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
             18years 299days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
   18years 300days HeadMMoid Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
18years 300days Bombadil Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
 18years 300days ksnake Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
 18years 299days tyree Re: [BM][RULES] Making Fuel same for ALL in Blue Max. Serious thought here.
Next thread
Posting elapsed timePosted bySubject

18years 295days Rico71 [BM][OT] Umm...am I the Rico in this game?
18years 295days pokerguy Re: [BM][OT] Umm...am I the Rico in this game?
Previous thread
Posting elapsed timePosted bySubject

18years 295days FENRIS [BM][OT] Parker,Poker and Templars
18years 295days FENRIS Re: [BM][OT] Parker,Poker and Templars
 18years 295days pokerguy Re: [BM][OT] Parker,Poker and Templars
Page generated in: 21.09375 milliseconds.