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City:Capital District, NY US
HomePage or other cool site:http://www.swa-gaming.org
Membership18years 327days ago.
Last Login1year 194days ago.
Last Move4years 212days ago.
TXWard is currently Offline!Send a mail to TXWard


Message header
Area/Game:General
Topic:General
Subject:Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
Posted by: TXWard - 17years 351days ago.
Message text
Zif wrote:

in an online community, who establishes the level of tolerance and extent to which something or someone is considered offensive? Is it the members of the community, whether all of it or just a vocal portion of it? No. It is the Webmaster(s) of said communities who establish the rules, laws, expectations, etc. that are to be abided by, wouldn't you agree?


No, I do not agree, but maybe it can be different in your country. Webmasters do not have the faculty to promulgate laws, allowing in the website something it is not legally allowed in the country. In the example of Italy, webmaster are responsible for the content of the hosted site, even if those sites are off national boundaries (pedopornography is prosecuted even if committed/supported off-shore).

So, the legal reply to something as nazi-apology is not left to discretion of people involved, or tolerance of the net-community : it is enforced by italian law (Legge n. 645 del 1952 http://www.stranieriinitalia.it/razzismo/scelba.html ) and nobody, not even the webmaster, could overrule this. In the case that happens, they have the civil-legal duty to take action or inform the authorities, according to law. That's why in my first post I wrote "You could create problems to the webmasters (...)".

Of course this is a last resort, because I guess that everybody should use his/her voice to invite a player to "avoid" nazi apologies.

About the personal feelings, that could bring one (not directly involved) to step personally in, making personally the request, or avoid to publicize the argument and make a private request to the webmaster, or just let it be and acting indifferent it is something that I leave to personal coscience. More specifically, to everyone tolerance, based on personal culture and personal inclinations.

You are correct, a website can not do something that is illegal to do. The "laws" I meant were those that apply to the site internally. It was probably not a good choice of synonyms on my part.

Your response to the Webmaster's request to ignore the offending pilot and allow him to deal with it was a quote from your Italian law, the translation of which stated that Nazi propaganda and promotion is illegal. That is fine for Italy, and all websites under its jurisdiction, but I don't think it applies to this case.

Using the name Adolf (which, IIRC was not a very unpopular name prior to 1940) is not Nazi propaganda. If linking to a historical site - museum, wikipedia, biography, etc. - is considered Nazi propaganda, then why are those sites and physical objects allowed to exist in Italy? Do Italian libraries contain no reference to Nazis on their shelves? No historical examinations of the Third Reich? No objective mention of the perpetrators of the Holocaust? How do you expect young Italians to learn from history by censoring a major element of it?

I think if you consulted a lawyer in your country, s/he would tell you that objective mention of Nazis does not constitute "propaganda" and as such, does not violate Italian law.

You had every right to notify the webmaster of your concerns about Hester. Even your public posting of it was within reason, although I considered it ill-advised because all that has transpired from it was highly predictable. However, to demand a change in another user's profile, demand the riddance of the user from the site altogether, and the hate mail you've sent me are all beyond your entitlements.

The webmasters are the law when it comes to this site, within the boundaries of the social laws of the jurisdiction from where they operate.

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17years 352days flying_neko on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
17years 352days SteveMartin Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
17years 352days imdog Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
17years 351days TXWard Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
17years 351days Tornade Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
17years 351days Zif Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
17years 351days TXWard Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
 17years 351days Zif Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
  17years 351days SteveMartin Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
   17years 350days TXWard Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
    17years 350days SteveMartin Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
     17years 349days TXWard Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
      17years 349days Zif Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
      17years 349days SteveMartin Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
17years 348days Ray_Collishaw Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
17years 351days gugliandalf Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
17years 349days DBurkeG Re: on boardgames, politics, and tolerating the intolerants
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